Having been born on Lupton Street (directly behind the Bratfud End) and then lived on Seldon street, Canterbury for a few of my formative years, I was never in to this hate City/hate Avenue business.
I would watch City when they were at home and then Avenue the following week and even in the Bratfud derby I wasn't too bothered who won.
But has I began to reach puberty my allegiance became more for City. Born where I was, I suppose the 'first love' syndrome came into it, but what I think had the biggest effect was the other Avenue fans.
They hated City with a vengeance, whereas in my opinion, the City fans were not that bothered either way about Avenue.
When Avenue went out of business, a few of you went over to the dark side to support L**ds .......Why ffs?
I have a few pals in my local in Wibsey who claim they're Avenue fans yet they don't know where Horsfall is .....yet they watch Beeston from time to time.
I suppose it's fitting that Bob is to build the new ground in L**ds
Full Version: Why do Avenue hate City
| QUOTE (NormanCorner @ Jul 30 2008, 04:02 PM) |
| Having been born on Lupton Street (directly behind the Bratfud End) and then lived on Seldon street, Canterbury for a few of my formative years, I was never in to this hate City/hate Avenue business. I would watch City when they were at home and then Avenue the following week and even in the Bratfud derby I wasn't too bothered who won. But has I began to reach puberty my allegiance became more for City. Born where I was, I suppose the 'first love' syndrome came into it, but what I think had the biggest effect was the other Avenue fans. They hated City with a vengeance, whereas in my opinion, the City fans were not that bothered either way about Avenue. When Avenue went out of business, a few of you went over to the dark side to support L**ds .......Why ffs? I have a few pals in my local in Wibsey who claim they're Avenue fans yet they don't know where Horsfall is .....yet they watch Beeston from time to time. I suppose it's fitting that Bob is to build the new ground in L**ds |
speaking for myself, due to my age, meaning i missed BPAFC in the FL, and not following Leeds i've been both sides of the fence, i don't hate Bradford City and i spent many years and lots of money watching you and had some good times.
I would question the passion and football knowledge of a large majority of BCFC supporters though, fair enough at both ends of the scale your doing well, you had the ointment/patsy's away tours obviously a very good bunch in there day, no one could question there passion
, and your ctc 73 lot were a good set of lads and quite a entertaining bunch despite not liking the town centre's of the opposition.It's the majority in the middle, got to say IMO, a right set of annoying numpties.
Maybe obvious Bradford rivalary aside, and your talking about before BCFC helped put avenue out of business, possibly that's why some avenue don't like you, they've no respect for you, the old avenue supporters know their football and are passionate about it.
Regarding watching Leeds, Bradford rivalary aside, if you stood on the kop at Leeds in the 70's/80's and then stood on the kop at City you'd have certainly noticed the difference.
It seems to me a lot of football people in Bradford don't follow city and never will, why is that, do you put it down to just glory hunting ?
QUOTE (Jez @ Jul 30 2008, 10:17 PM)
| QUOTE (NormanCorner @ Jul 30 2008, 04:02 PM) |
| Having been born on Lupton Street (directly behind the Bratfud End) and then lived on Seldon street, Canterbury for a few of my formative years, I was never in to this hate City/hate Avenue business. I would watch City when they were at home and then Avenue the following week and even in the Bratfud derby I wasn't too bothered who won. But has I began to reach puberty my allegiance became more for City. Born where I was, I suppose the 'first love' syndrome came into it, but what I think had the biggest effect was the other Avenue fans. They hated City with a vengeance, whereas in my opinion, the City fans were not that bothered either way about Avenue. When Avenue went out of business, a few of you went over to the dark side to support L**ds .......Why ffs? I have a few pals in my local in Wibsey who claim they're Avenue fans yet they don't know where Horsfall is .....yet they watch Beeston from time to time. I suppose it's fitting that Bob is to build the new ground in L**ds |
speaking for myself, due to my age, meaning i missed BPAFC in the FL, and not following Leeds i've been both sides of the fence, i don't hate Bradford City and i spent many years and lots of money watching you and had some good times.
I would question the passion and football knowledge of a large majority of BCFC supporters though, fair enough at both ends of the scale your doing well, you had the ointment/patsy's away tours obviously a very good bunch in there day, no one could question there passion
, and your ctc 73 lot were a good set of lads and quite a entertaining bunch despite not liking the town centre's of the opposition.It's the majority in the middle, got to say IMO, a right set of annoying numpties.
Maybe obvious Bradford rivalary aside, and your talking about before BCFC helped put avenue out of business, possibly that's why some avenue don't like you, they've no respect for you, the old avenue supporters know their football and are passionate about it.
Regarding watching Leeds, Bradford rivalary aside, if you stood on the kop at Leeds in the 70's/80's and then stood on the kop at City you'd have certainly noticed the difference.
It seems to me a lot of football people in Bradford don't follow city and never will, why is that, do you put it down to just glory hunting ?
speaking as a bradford white and avenue fan the 1st game i went to was ave v york in 1969 div 4 i was 5 year old but never forgot it the next game i went to was leeds v west ham in 69 the atmosphere blew me from then on i was hooked on leeds BUT never forgot avenue so now when leeds are away i go to avenue like most leeds fans i couldnt give a toss about city . have some good mates who support them as i reminded one of them at horsfall 2 week ago He said we must outnumber you 2 to 1 ! i replied you should know that feeling from leeds visits to bradford lol !
| QUOTE (peterlorimer @ Jul 31 2008, 02:05 PM) |
| BCFC helped put avenue out of business |
How did city put avenue out of business? Could you clarify - this is a serious accusation
Some of us still remember the great Stafford Heginbotham con of 1973 in which Avenue and City were going to merge. The new club would be called Bradford Metro and play in puke and sh**e, the colour of corporation dust carts. Avenue were conned into moving to Manningham to get our fans used to going there. 12 months later Avenue closed down, and 3 weeks later Heginbotham announced that Bardford City was the name on the FA Cup and they wouldn't be changing it.
It was all a trick to take over the highly successful Avenue Development Fund. The poor misguided souls who ran it were stupid enough to continue with it making money for b***y Manningham. Meanwhile the Avenue directors were allowed to be second division directors at Manningham without even a proper seat on the board.
The real Avenue fans renamed the supporters team Bradford PA (1975) and kept the flag flying in the Bradford Sunday League.
It was all a trick to take over the highly successful Avenue Development Fund. The poor misguided souls who ran it were stupid enough to continue with it making money for b***y Manningham. Meanwhile the Avenue directors were allowed to be second division directors at Manningham without even a proper seat on the board.
The real Avenue fans renamed the supporters team Bradford PA (1975) and kept the flag flying in the Bradford Sunday League.
b.t.w. do rangers like celtic ? scum like man city ? liverpool like everton ? bristol rovers like city ? ................. ffs norman its called city rivalry !
| QUOTE (Worried of Guildford @ Aug 1 2008, 08:58 AM) |
| Some of us still remember the great Stafford Heginbotham con of 1973 in which Avenue and City were going to merge. The new club would be called Bradford Metro and play in puke and sh**e, the colour of corporation dust carts. Avenue were conned into moving to Manningham to get our fans used to going there. 12 months later Avenue closed down, and 3 weeks later Heginbotham announced that Bardford City was the name on the FA Cup and they wouldn't be changing it. It was all a trick to take over the highly successful Avenue Development Fund. The poor misguided souls who ran it were stupid enough to continue with it making money for b***y Manningham. Meanwhile the Avenue directors were allowed to be second division directors at Manningham without even a proper seat on the board. The real Avenue fans renamed the supporters team Bradford PA (1975) and kept the flag flying in the Bradford Sunday League. |
Total rubbish - Bradford city put Avenue out of business. Bradford Park Avenue went out of business due to poor management over a number of years by simply spending more money than they earned.
The sale of Park Avenue football ground to a property developer reduced attendances to such low levels at Valley Parade that the club simply wasn't viable as a going concern.
The final straw came when the club received a vat bill due to the sale of Park Avenue months earlier
Bradford City played no part in the fall of the Avenue. it was poor management, loss of league status and apathy amongst the bradford public towards the club.
Poor management - yes. Should have never sold Hector and Ham so cheaply. Jack Rowley was a disaster, Herbert Metcalfe was a barmpot. Loss of league status - yes. Apathy from the Bradford public - No. Avenue's gates were excellent considering the 7 seaaons of garbage we had to watch from 1966 to 1974.
The club didn't spend beyond its means. It simply couldn't service Div 4 debts on non-league gates. The same thing happened to Newport, Gateshead, Halifax and Scarborough. Avenue only went bust for £60,000. We didn't get away with cheating our creditors out of £30 million like Manningham and Leeds.
The other villains in Avenue's demise were Bradford Corporation under the leadership of Councillor Eddie Newby. The corporation and Heginbotham did a deal under which the council "bought" VP off City then let them buy it back at the same price 10 years later.
They refused Avenue a similar deal. Avenue sold their ground in 1973 to a property developer for £90,000, much less than it was worth. Once Avenue went bust, the council bought it for much more than that, ostensibly for the use of Bradford Northern. Had they offered Avenue full value in 73, the club would not have gone bust.
The club didn't spend beyond its means. It simply couldn't service Div 4 debts on non-league gates. The same thing happened to Newport, Gateshead, Halifax and Scarborough. Avenue only went bust for £60,000. We didn't get away with cheating our creditors out of £30 million like Manningham and Leeds.
The other villains in Avenue's demise were Bradford Corporation under the leadership of Councillor Eddie Newby. The corporation and Heginbotham did a deal under which the council "bought" VP off City then let them buy it back at the same price 10 years later.
They refused Avenue a similar deal. Avenue sold their ground in 1973 to a property developer for £90,000, much less than it was worth. Once Avenue went bust, the council bought it for much more than that, ostensibly for the use of Bradford Northern. Had they offered Avenue full value in 73, the club would not have gone bust.
| QUOTE (Worried of Guildford @ Aug 1 2008, 07:46 PM) |
| Poor management - yes. Should have never sold Hector and Ham so cheaply. Jack Rowley was a disaster, Herbert Metcalfe was a barmpot. Loss of league status - yes. Apathy from the Bradford public - No. Avenue's gates were excellent considering the 7 seaaons of garbage we had to watch from 1966 to 1974. The club didn't spend beyond its means. It simply couldn't service Div 4 debts on non-league gates. The same thing happened to Newport, Gateshead, Halifax and Scarborough. Avenue only went bust for £60,000. We didn't get away with cheating our creditors out of £30 million like Manningham and Leeds. The other villains in Avenue's demise were Bradford Corporation under the leadership of Councillor Eddie Newby. The corporation and Heginbotham did a deal under which the council "bought" VP off City then let them buy it back at the same price 10 years later. They refused Avenue a similar deal. Avenue sold their ground in 1973 to a property developer for £90,000, much less than it was worth. Once Avenue went bust, the council bought it for much more than that, ostensibly for the use of Bradford Northern. Had they offered Avenue full value in 73, the club would not have gone bust. |
Agree with most of what you say, but you can't blame Bradford city for getting a good deal for avenue failer. At the end of the day, city were looking after number one, like any business would.
As for the council attitude towards Avenue, it was a disgrace.
One question, if the bradford Park Avenue supporters cared so much for the club, why did only 600 turn out on average during their last season at valley parade. If it was because they were playing at city then that's a poor reason for not supporting your home town club.
Also no rescue attempt of any note and no reformation apart from a small band of supporters (less than 30) who bothered.
Yes Avenue supporters really cared in large numbers back in 1974, i don't think so do you.
You cannot overestimate the psychological effect of being kicked out of the league and eight years of constant failure. It all ended in a final depressing year playing at Manningham in Arsenal shirts. It just wasn't the Avenue anymore.
Die-hard fans like me wanted the club reformed - we just didn't know how to do it. We were too young. In the late 1970's, I personally attended a meeting with Bradford Council to discuss the possibility of BPA 75 playing at the old stadium. But it came to nothing, we weren't businessmen.
But some of us stayed loyal to the cause and didn't betray out home town and b***r off to Leeds. The glory seekers laughed at us. Supporters of Springfield Youth Club said we were dreaming after they hammered us 5-0.
But we're still here - and at long last, the business community are getting behind the club. When the good times and the glory seekers return, perhaps it will be time to remember the words of Winston Churchill.
"Never in the field of human conflict has so much been owed by so many to so few"
Die-hard fans like me wanted the club reformed - we just didn't know how to do it. We were too young. In the late 1970's, I personally attended a meeting with Bradford Council to discuss the possibility of BPA 75 playing at the old stadium. But it came to nothing, we weren't businessmen.
But some of us stayed loyal to the cause and didn't betray out home town and b***r off to Leeds. The glory seekers laughed at us. Supporters of Springfield Youth Club said we were dreaming after they hammered us 5-0.
But we're still here - and at long last, the business community are getting behind the club. When the good times and the glory seekers return, perhaps it will be time to remember the words of Winston Churchill.
"Never in the field of human conflict has so much been owed by so many to so few"
| QUOTE (Worried of Guildford @ Aug 1 2008, 10:58 PM) |
| You cannot overestimate the psychological effect of being kicked out of the league and eight years of constant failure. It all ended in a final depressing year playing at Manningham in Arsenal shirts. It just wasn't the Avenue anymore. Die-hard fans like me wanted the club reformed - we just didn't know how to do it. We were too young. In the late 1970's, I personally attended a meeting with Bradford Council to discuss the possibility of BPA 75 playing at the old stadium. But it came to nothing, we weren't businessmen. But some of us stayed loyal to the cause and didn't betray out home town and b***r off to Leeds. The glory seekers laughed at us. Supporters of Springfield Youth Club said we were dreaming after they hammered us 5-0. But we're still here - and at long last, the business community are getting behind the club. When the good times and the glory seekers return, perhaps it will be time to remember the words of Winston Churchill. "Never in the field of human conflict has so much been owed by so many to so few" |
Whatever the rights & wrongs of a time over 25 years years ago really doesn't matter.
What does matter is what happens this season both on & off the pitch
All I would ask is that true avenue fans get behind the team and lets make this a season to remember.
kev
"Those that forget the past are condemned to repeat it." George Santayana.
QUOTE (kev @ Aug 2 2008, 02:07 AM)
| QUOTE (Worried of Guildford @ Aug 1 2008, 10:58 PM) |
| You cannot overestimate the psychological effect of being kicked out of the league and eight years of constant failure. It all ended in a final depressing year playing at Manningham in Arsenal shirts. It just wasn't the Avenue anymore. Die-hard fans like me wanted the club reformed - we just didn't know how to do it. We were too young. In the late 1970's, I personally attended a meeting with Bradford Council to discuss the possibility of BPA 75 playing at the old stadium. But it came to nothing, we weren't businessmen. But some of us stayed loyal to the cause and didn't betray out home town and b***r off to Leeds. The glory seekers laughed at us. Supporters of Springfield Youth Club said we were dreaming after they hammered us 5-0. But we're still here - and at long last, the business community are getting behind the club. When the good times and the glory seekers return, perhaps it will be time to remember the words of Winston Churchill. "Never in the field of human conflict has so much been owed by so many to so few" |
Whatever the rights & wrongs of a time over 25 years years ago really doesn't matter.
What does matter is what happens this season both on & off the pitch
All I would ask is that true avenue fans get behind the team and lets make this a season to remember.
kev
Kev- agree with what you say and looking forward to another step on our road towards the football league.
Many clubs that get into financial trouble today seem to get rescued from the trap door.
It's interesting to know what went on in the 1970s with the avenue and why no businessman or a consortium never came forward to rescue the Avenue. I accept those dark days in the early 1970s, supporters were not as well informed on the subject as they are today. Also non league football was not connected as today to the football league apart from a rig voting system.
It's interesting to know that BPA 75 tried to return to the old ground and those people who stayed loyal deserve total respect. It must have been a frustrating and sad time seeing your former ground neglected all those years without being in a position to do anything about it.
I have heard many people say that avenue death was a slow one and if Herbert Metcalfe hadn.t come forward when he did, Avenue would have gone bust as a football league club and then may have been rescued. The fact that Avenue death was a slow one and the club was by 1974 in non league football that the majority had lost interest.
It would make an interesting read about the club last few years from a supporters perpective point of view and what went on after the club folded. The hopes and the disappointments of bradford park avenue 75 to the present day.
I agree, what is of interest is why no consortium or businessman came to rescue Avenue, especially when they were still at Park Avenue? It is difficult to imagine in today's times that Avenue went out of business for the tune of just £57,000!!
| QUOTE (johnxl @ Aug 2 2008, 07:55 PM) |
| http://www.blinkx.com/video/football-manag...BG7pp6Qq50x6B5Q |
quality JXL !!!
QUOTE (The Irish Rover @ Aug 2 2008, 08:07 PM)
| QUOTE (johnxl @ Aug 2 2008, 07:55 PM) |
| http://www.blinkx.com/video/football-manag...BG7pp6Qq50x6B5Q |
quality JXL !!!
That's really a German kid losing on a game called "Counter Strike:Source" but its a good take off...
and just as funny as original
I will never forget the stick that lot gave us dad would never go to the other place for the last season . Now though lets forget them and back the Avenue.